Comments for distal muse

Comment on Brief Comment About Debt and Taxes by Mark Tiedemann

Mark Tiedemann — Thu, 17 May 2012 12:07:13 +0000

As you pointed out, with full (or, least, fuller) employment, costs for the safety net go down. With a reduction of expenses and an increase in revenues, it then becomes a matter of sensible expenditures.

I’m not even pretending this addresses all the problems. We have created such a complex system of gimmes that untangling it inevitably gores someone’s ox, but my point is we’re so focused on the simple fact of income inequity that if you just look at the public discourse it’s clear many if not most people think that is all we need to address to fix things. Well, in a way it is, but the way in which we’re talking about fixes is moronic.

That last third of a trillion is probably the loss in customs revenue from our going from a net exporter to a net importer—and that is another issue that is related but different.

Comment on Brief Comment About Debt and Taxes by Mark Tiedemann

Mark Tiedemann — Thu, 17 May 2012 12:02:42 +0000

Sorry, I can’t find a setting that sends a response notification.

Comment on Brief Comment About Debt and Taxes by Mark Tiedemann

Mark Tiedemann — Thu, 17 May 2012 11:51:38 +0000

Oh, don’t get me wrong, I’m not optimistic. But unless we’re willing to address all the elements of a problem, nothing gets fixed. I’m merely pointing out that there is more than one 800 lb gorilla in the room.

Comment on Brief Comment About Debt and Taxes by Mark Tiedemann

Mark Tiedemann — Thu, 17 May 2012 11:50:07 +0000

Hmm. I don’t know. I’ve had so little active commentary on here that I never looked into it.

Comment on Brief Comment About Debt and Taxes by Jim White

Jim White — Thu, 17 May 2012 04:01:43 +0000

Do we have some process of notification when a comment is responded to?

Comment on Brief Comment About Debt and Taxes by Jim White

Jim White — Thu, 17 May 2012 04:00:36 +0000

Not much. The minimum third of trillion dollar annual deficit is what happens in the fantasy land where everybody who wants it gets full employment and we jack taxes up more than is politically likely (or effective, since higher taxes suppress taxable activity). It’s an end state that I don’t think is obtainable, but even that end state is way short of balancing a budget. How will repeating that structural deficit for a number of years improve it any? Rather, continuous deficits increase the debt, which causes increasing interest payments or (worse) increased inflation from monetizing the debt. Existing federal expenditures cannot continue on their present path.

I’ve played the budget models. I can’t find anywhere near another third of a trillion dollars (after reduction of the safety nets) that I can conceive of any elected government cutting. So, no–while I agree with some of your subpoints, I don’t share your optimism that the problem can be fixed.

Comment on Brief Comment About Debt and Taxes by Mark Tiedemann

Mark Tiedemann — Wed, 16 May 2012 19:26:07 +0000

I estimated taxes generated from a combination of personal federal taxes and payroll taxes, but I said they were loose. But I think I also implied that reduction of deficits would take place over time, not in one year. other than that, do I detect some agreement from you, Jim?

Comment on Hating the Government: An American Tradition. by sulfur soap

sulfur soap — Wed, 16 May 2012 19:09:38 +0000

Actually, the tipping point started a little earlier, in 1913 with the passage of the Federal Reserve Act and the passage of the 16th Amendment (Federal Income taxes) both passed under President Wilson and under the direction/supervision of Colonel Edward M. House (the author of Philip Dru: Administrator and not a Colonel in any Army).

Comment on Brief Comment About Debt and Taxes by Jim White

Jim White — Wed, 16 May 2012 16:24:20 +0000

Your numbers don’t track. At 30k, people don’t pay anywhere near 25% taxes–more like half that, even before standard deductions, and even before subtracting the earned income credit. But at “full employment”, the government would also spend less on safety net programs. All told, full employment would only solve about a third of the current deficit–call it 340 billion out of a trillion. http://www.cbo.gov/sites/default/files/cbofiles/attachments/10-04-Portion_of_Deficit_Due_to_Cyclical_Weakness.pdf

Taxing the hell out of the rich and corporations would solve less than another third. There’d still be about a third of a trillion dollars a year more being spent than would be raised.

Comment on Brief Comment About Debt and Taxes by Kai Jones

Kai Jones — Wed, 16 May 2012 15:59:09 +0000

You make an excellent point about the uncounted unemployed. My husband was laid off 3 years ago, finally found a part-time job at much lower pay last fall–he’s paying a lot less in income tax (and his employers are paying less in payroll taxes).